Comments on Seek the Horizon, Númenor's Sons

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I really liked this, Dawn - I liked the repetition of 'seek the horizon, but not too far.' The Ban of the Valar often reminds me a bit of the story in Genesis of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil - you can eat any fruit, but not that one! The Valar tell the Numenoreans 'you can sail any direction but west!' IMO, if Pharazon hadn't been incited to rebellion, sooner or later some other mariner would've gotten just curious enough to break the  Ban.

I'll stop rambling now - but I liked this!



Thank you, Steel! When I was rereading the Akallabeth to get ideas for this piece, I found this quotation particularly illustrative of the point you make:

But the design of Manwë was that the Númenóreans should not be tempted to seek for the Blessed Realm, nor desire to overpass the limits set to their bliss, becoming enamoured of the immortality of the Valar and the Eldar and the lands where all things endure.

Right down to the word \"tempt\"--I can\'t believe that this wasn\'t deliberate on Tolkien\'s part although, personally, I think it shows more the folly of Manwe than anything else.

Thanks again for reading and reviewing! :)

Thank you, Ithilwen! :) I\'m glad the repetition worked, too; this was my first try using so much of it!

I\'ve been thinking on SurgicalSteel\'s review, and now yours, and this quote from \"Of Feanor\" kind of makes sense of apparent denseness of the Valar (esp. Manwe):

For Manwë was free from evil and could not comprehend it, and he knew that in the beginning, in the thought of Ilúvatar, Melkor had been even as he; and he saw not to the depths of Melkor’s heart, and did not perceive that all love had departed from him for ever. But Ulmo was not deceived, and Tulkas clenched his hands whenever he saw Melkor his foe go by; for if Tulkas is slow to wrath he is slow also to forget. But they obeyed the judgement of Manwë; for those who will defend authority against rebellion must not themselves rebel.

Or: \"Well, I would do as I\'m told just because I\'m told to do it so they must too!\" Which seems a considerable liability in one who must preside over beings that possess free will! :D

A wonderful protest poem, it reminds me of young adults rebelling against the established order. Two thoughts came to me: did the Valar never learn from the Noldorin rebellion and.. no wonderthat the Numenoreans grew restless, feeling denied of so much. You can't really blame them for not seeking things out. I can so see Bob Dylan singing this :D

 



How cool that you saw it as a protest song! I didn\'t intend it as such, but you know me well enough to know that I love the idea! :D

You would think they would have learned from the Noldorin rebellion, wouldn\'t you? As I replied to Ithilwen, I think the key, for me, to understanding Manwe\'s ignorance of this comes in the \"Of Feanor\" chapter, when it is said that he cannot fathom \"evil.\" And evil, it seems--at least to the Valar--includes disobedience. At least, we never see them doing anything but accepting Eru\'s word on things. But this is a pretty big shortcoming in a being that is supposed to serve as the Highest of High Kings over people that possess free will. And that--even after Feanor and the Noldor--he can believe that the Numenoreans will accept the Ban just because he tells them that it\'s their place in the world to do so ... that really is profound ignorance.

It seems to me that Manwe--and, to a lesser extent, the other Valar--don\'t really grasp that the Eruhini aspire to meet and exceed their potential, which will always make them want what they are told it is not their place in the world to have. Feanor, Pharazon, even Melkor--the sins of all were coveting they were told they could not have. Perhaps because Manwe has the highest attainment of any on Arda, he is unable to understand what it means \"to strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.\"

As always, Rhapsody, thank you for reading and reviewing! Now I\'m going to be trying to fit \"Seek the Horizon\" to a Dylanesque song! :D

Roisin! *gently glomps* It\'s so good to see you back online. :)

I\'m really pleased that you picked up on the rhythm of the poem; I wanted it to be a \"sea chant,\" sung while the mariners are at their work to the rhythm of the waves. It was a fun poem to write, though entirely spur-of-the-moment (written about five hours before it was posted); I\'m tickled that it\'s being reviewed so well! Thank you!

You are most welcome--and thank you again for such a lovely review! :) I do think that the Akallabeth would have happened eventually. I think the Valar were rather foolish if they truly think that it would not, but then, Manwe especially did seem somewhat blinkered in not being able to comprehend evil, which (to the Valar anyway) seems to include disobedience. Certainly not the best trait for one expected to preside over a whole gaggle of beings that possess free will! :D

Dawn, kudos to your delivering a poem that captures the "high mythic" quality of an ancient bard, whether of Tolkien's secondary world or one from Anglo-Saxon England, Taliesin's Wales or the green hills of Ireland.  It really has that tone, blending out own primary world's traditions with Tolkien's secondary ones (which, of course, draw from the primary). 

As Roisin said, there's the swell of the sea here and evocative phrasing that makes the hawk's flight of imagination soar: a sea of silver glass, thunder-struck sand, scythe-curve of (the) keel, towers of powd'ry stone, down a path by Elf-light paved.

Then the warning stanzas at the end...telling the mariners and the reader that Faerie is a perilous place "where the mountains gouge the sky."

So as much as there are no faeries in my garden (and you know what I mean by that), when I read your poem, my heart is stirred like the ancient mariners -- whether from Númenor or St. Brendan -- and I yearn for the forbidden West.

Oh, yeah.  I liked your poem a lot. :^) 



This review has truly made my evening. Thank you so much for your kind words! :)

In fact, part of my inspiration for this piece came from our conversation the other day about alliterative verse when I was complaining about how verse constructed as part of the oral tradition is sometimes squished and squeezed to make sense of it in the same way as verse intended for the printed page. I\'ll confess that--not being a particularly confident poet--I am much more comfortable writing highly structured poetry: sonnets and sestinas and Pearl-type poems where I can claim a modicum of success if I manage to \"follow the rules\" and still make sense. With this one, though, I decided to follow my own preaching about alliterative verse and throw caution to the wind and \"play by ear,\" so to speak.

I have to say that I\'m thrilled (and relieved) that--judging by the reviews here--it seems to have worked for some people at least, including many writers whose poetry (and prose) I enjoy immensely.

I am far from a Second Age expert, but the Akallabeth has always been, to me, one of JRRT\'s most evocative pieces of writing. When I read it, I see in my mind\'s eye the ships and the sea and white harbors glinting in the distance. I definitely hoped to bring some of those images to life in this poem.

Thank you again--and now I will be grinning like a goof for the rest of the night! 8D

Thank you, Lidya! :) That is a great point, and I\'d never thought of it that way before. It\'s sort of like the active hands and minds of the Noldor were also their strength and downfall. Though it makes me again wonder what the Valar were thinking when they placed a people with such potential within sight of a deathless land and told them they couldn\'t go exploring ... *sigh*