Interview with Cynthia Gates, a.k.a. pandemonium_213 by Grundy by pandemonium_213, Grundy

Fans of Tolkien will typically identify love, loyalty, nature, and hope as defining themes in his work. Less often do they see the legendarium as fertile grounds for exploring the use of science and technology. Cindy Gates, who has written under the pseudonym pandemonium_213 and retired from a scientific career last year, has written fanworks and meta for much of the SWG's history that do the opposite, presenting Middle-earth as a land where people face the same questions about science and technology that we do. Grundy spoke to Cindy about her upcoming Mereth Aderthad 2025 presentation, "Tolkien, Lunatic Physicists, and Abnegation" and the many fruitful connections between the Manhattan Project and The Silmarillion.

Grundy: What drew you to Tolkien?

Cindy: Even when I was a kid, I liked sci-fi and fantasy, and I read anything I could get my hands on. My older brother had a ton of sci-fi/fantasy magazines and books. My mom introduced me to Wind in the Willows, and then to The Princess and The Goblin by George McDonald, who was a significant influence on fantasy and subsequent authors. So of course I eventually stumbled onto Tolkien.

Grundy: I’m curious, what is your favorite part of the legendarium?

Cindy: The Rings of Power—Eregion, and the Elves being in favor of science and technology!

Grundy: That leads nicely into the big question - why did you choose this topic? What sparked the idea?

Cindy: I’ve had a longtime interest in J. Robert Oppenheimer and the Manhattan Project, inspired by the excellent PBS 1980s drama series, Oppenheimer, starring Sam Waterston (from Law and Order!) in the title role. In 2006, after a number of years as a senior scientist in the biopharmaceutical industry, I read American Prometheus: The Triumph and Tragedy of J. Robert Oppenheimer by Kai Bird and Martin Sherwin. This is an authoritative biography of Oppie and includes his experiences with colleagues on the Manhattan Project. Bird and Sherwin chronicle their scientific curiosity, their drive and urgency, and the moral quandaries posed by the development of the atomic bomb. As a scientist in one of what has become a cliché of “bad industries,” e.g., Big Tobacco, Big Oil, and Big Pharma, I could relate at least a little bit to the moral quandaries of seeing our science in pharma R&D, which was developed with the best of intentions (helping patients), being transformed into costly marketing campaigns with television commercials, glossy print advertisements, and pricing strategies (profiteering).

Shortly after reading American Prometheus, I re-read The Lord of the Rings and The Silmarillion. It had been a long break since I read Tolkien, and this time around, the theme of well-intentioned science that is turned into something that damages, sometimes profoundly, hit me like a ton of bricks. Furthermore, it seemed to me that Tolkien tended to make object lessons of the more technical/scientific types in his legendarium. I opined about this in my screed, “The Tolkienian War on Science,” which I wrote for the erstwhile Science Blogs, part of SEED magazine. It’s also on the SWG. At any rate, reading American Prometheus and The Silmarillion back-to-back essentially launched my foray into fanfiction as pandemonium_213, where I make the vast majority of my commentary on Tolkien’s characters (or Tolkien-inspired original characters) who are “on the side of science and technology.”¹

So, I chose the topic of “Tolkien, Lunatic Physicists and Abnegation” as a more scholarly approach to my ficcish commentary. After reading what the Manhattan Project scientists went through to develop the atomic bomb and how they dealt with the consequences, I felt that Tolkien’s tart remark about “lunatic physicists” in Letter 102² seemed demeaning, even as we share his horror at the devastation of Hiroshima and Nagasaki and the subsequent arms race. Tolkien felt strongly that the assumption that because “a thing can be done, it must be done” was false and that abnegation—the deliberate refusal to do some of the things it is possible to do with, say, atomic power—was the more noble path. In marked contrast, Oppenheimer and the Manhattan Project physicists took a very different tack, and it is this stark contrast that inspired my topic.

Grundy: You mentioned your ‘ficcish commentary’—are there any of your fanworks you particularly wish to highlight?

Cindy: Trinity of course, which directly ties the Manhattan Project to The Silmarillion! Also The Apprentice, which likewise concerns science and technology in Middle-earth by following an original character appointed as an apprentice in Eregion as Celebrimbor and Annatar develop the technology that will become the Rings of Power. Ulmo’s Wife explores Ulmo's connection to the ocean. The Chronicles of the Fifth Voyage of the Númerrámar: The Loremaster Arrives likewise focuses more on naturalistic sciences, and Saltation considers the origin story of the Elves at Cuiviénen.

Grundy: Bringing it full circle, are you going to work any of this – meaning your presentation topic - into fic?

Cindy: Yes! There will be visions, which will be addressed in The Writhen Pool. In fact, Elrond already has experienced a hallucinogenic vision of the Trinity test site in the Jornada del Muerto desert (see Chapter 11, “The Path’s Heart”). Now that I have retired, I have time to go back to this WIP so stay tuned!

Notes

1. The Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien, "153 To Peter Hastings (draft)": "The particular branch of the High-Elves concerned, the Noldor or Loremasters, were always on the side of ‘science and technology’, as we should call it: they wanted to have the knowledge that Sauron genuinely had, and those of Eregion refused the warnings of Gilgalad and Elrond."
2. Ibid., "102 From a letter to Christopher Tolkien": "The news today about ‘Atomic bombs’ is so horrifying one is stunned. The utter folly of these lunatic physicists to consent to do such work for war-purposes: calmly plotting the destruction of the world!"